Marta Rus: how to stand out on LinkedIn in the age of AI

Transcription

Daniel: The market is saturated, not necessarily competitive. Fear is really just a construct. It's a bunch of thoughts in our head that we believe to be true. There is so much more to life than living somebody else's dream. Your uniqueness is your superpower and actually the fact that there is no one else out there with your voice and your message. Matt: What are some of the biggest things that you've had to unlearn? Daniel: Biggest learning for me was... I don't think I shared this anywhere, so it's really exciting to be able to talk about it. I would say, and this is gonna sound a little bit obvious and maybe a little bit cheesy because everyone's been talking about this very thing, but it's authenticity. Sounds really harsh, but I mean. Matt: Welcome to Connection Accepted. Today, I'm so excited. We've got a really exciting guest on the pod. We have Marta. Marta, thanks for joining me. Marta: Of course, thank you so much for having me. I'm so excited to be here. Matt: Marta, for the audience, can we just start with a quick background on who you are, where you're from, and what you do? Marta: 100%. So I'm originally from Poland. I left home when I was in my late teens. I've always had this passion for travel and wanted to experience more of what the world had to offer, which really is the theme that drove me to what I do today. Marta: And as for my background, it all started when I decided to quit my job to travel, which really inspired me to start working for myself so I could create a life that's really aligned with who I am as a person and with my vision for the future. And that took me down the path of content creation combined with coaching, which together really beautifully led to branding, which I personally think is a wonderful sort of way of combining both. Branding being another form of self-discovery and content creation supporting it beautifully. So that's me in a nutshell, I guess. Matt: Let's take a step back there and let's talk about before you even started posting on LinkedIn, you were on Instagram, correct? Marta: That's right. Matt: What kind of led you there? What led you there and what kind of content were you making at that time? Marta: Right. So again, this ties to me quitting my job and heading off on this solo trip for India. I spent six years, six months, although the trip pretty much never ended given how I continued living. So six months traveling solo for India, which rather serendipitously led to me spending nine months in New York. And that's when I really realized, you know, there is so much more to life than living somebody else's dream. And I wanted to create a life that was uniquely mine. So with that, I decided to start working for myself and I did. Thanks to that, I was able to travel pretty much as I wanted, where I wanted, and I was sharing all my adventures online. Daniel: And I had so many people asking me like, oh, like how did that come about? Like, how are you able to make it happen? This was years and years before COVID when working remotely wasn't quite as normalized. And that made me think, you know what, let me create an online space where I share with others exactly how I made it happen. So that led me to Instagram. Initially, I created my channel so I could show other women how they, sort of create a life on their terms, a life that really lights them up within that is an expression of who they really are rather than having to follow somebody else's, you know, idea of what happiness is. And that's what really started it. And then I kind of seamlessly tied in my love for travel into my content and ended up working as a travel influencer for many, many years. And yeah, that's really how the journey with Instagram started. Matt: Yeah, that's incredible. I mean, I think probably at the time when you started, like you said, there probably wasn't as much information out there about how to actually turn that into a sustainable lifestyle or business. So when you were trying to figure it out on your own, was it just sort of making mistakes and learning as you went, or did you have other resources or people in your life that sort of helped you to make that transition? Daniel: I would say it was a mix of both. But I definitely did my research as well. Like I really approached my LinkedIn journey as if it was a full-on business. Matt: I still remember spending hours learning a little bit more about, you know, digital marketing, what it takes to create good content. I also had a blog at the time, so I really wanted to understand more about what it takes to grow your audience. So I definitely did my research. But I think what really helped was this genuine desire to make a difference and really following something that I was deeply passionate about. And I think that really is the core of what makes you stand out, of what makes you successful. No amount of carefully planned strategy can, you know, override genuine passion and genuine purpose. So always start there, I would say. I think you hit on such an important point, Marta, which is following what actually excites you versus just doing what people say you should do. And this is something that personally I have learned just from experience, you know, with my content creation journey as well as professionally as well. Daniel: Well, I think the thing that you can do the longest usually tends to be the thing that also excites you the most, right? Because when things get hard, you can still go a little bit further because genuinely, you're intrinsically motivated by that, as opposed to just doing something because maybe people around you think it's the right thing to do. And I want to ask you as well, Marta, Instagram and LinkedIn are obviously very different platforms. Matt: What was going through your head when you eventually switched over to LinkedIn, even though you already had a pretty successful Instagram page, right, on about your travels on Instagram? Daniel: I find that that's such a great question, by the way. And for me, it was the fact that as much as I love Instagram, I find that your voice really gets lost in the noise, right? There's so many people on the app, and there's a hundred different reasons why anyone would be on Instagram, right? It could be to watch cat videos, or maybe learn something, or maybe you just want to watch fun reels. So it's so easy to get lost in the crowd, and your message gets really saturated, whereas with LinkedIn, correct me if I'm wrong, I think there's about 1 billion people on LinkedIn, but only about 1% of them are posting actively at least, which means that your voice really has the opportunity to stand out. Not to mention, the people you connect with on LinkedIn, everyone there has a very clear purpose, right? It's either to buy or sell something, or to learn. So it's so much easier to get your message seen and also meet people that really resonate with what it is you have to offer. For me, a huge part of being present on LinkedIn is also the amazing conversations I get to have with founders. Daniel: I mean, we met on LinkedIn as well, right? So there's so many opportunities for genuine connection that very much still exists on Instagram, but I just find it to be so much more saturated in a way that LinkedIn isn't. Matt: That's such a good point, right? Because even though there's probably way more users on Instagram than on LinkedIn in total, the people that go to LinkedIn are a very specific type of person, and they're usually going there for a specific thing. It's no mystery that there's a lot of executives and people who control the budgets at large companies that are on LinkedIn. I think there's some stat, and don't quote me on this, which is like 95% of all Fortune 500 CEOs have a LinkedIn account or are active on LinkedIn. And I think that's just a good sign that if you are a business owner or somebody who sells to other businesses, LinkedIn is the platform that you need to be on. In your case, I'm curious, do most of your clients for your personal branding business, are they executives? Are they professionals? What kind of people are you sort of working with? Daniel: Yeah, I would say they're mostly founders. Execs, I would say majority of them would be founders within wellness, but also and I love seeing that as well because that really was the purpose behind my brand. It's a lot of people try to make a genuine difference. Daniel: So you don't necessarily have to be in wellness to support that, but what they all have in common is the shared mission and vision to contribute in some way. So whether you're building an AI app that in some way helps other people's mission and business shine, or whether you are a wellness founder or yoga coach, that vision stays the same. So I would say that's the common determiner, but mostly founders, I would say. Matt: That's awesome. And with the personal branding space, especially on LinkedIn, are there any things that you have seen with clients, with your own account that you think really resonate with the LinkedIn audience? Daniel: I would say, and this is going to sound a little bit obvious and maybe a little bit cheesy because everyone seems to be talking about this very thing, but it's authenticity. There's a reason why everyone talks about it though, right? Because being authentic is not just sharing the highlights, it's sharing the behind the scenes. It's sharing the struggle. It's being vulnerable. And it's hard to be vulnerable online when so many people are watching, but I genuinely do believe that people are so much more connected to that sense of authenticity that comes from vulnerability rather than, you know, I make money in my sleep. I mean, that's great. There's so many people who are still, you know, figuring out how to start the business or, you know, as founders, entrepreneurs, we all go through moments when we doubt ourselves and sometimes the going gets hard. Daniel: And I find that those stories, they not only give people a sense of, you know, hope and inspiration, but they also get to see the person behind the brand, not just the successful entrepreneur who seems to have it all figured out, because I genuinely don't believe anyone has it all figured out, but a person just like them who goes through moments of struggle and hesitation and confusion, but still keeps going. And I think it's really beautiful to build that sense of connection. Like remember that we're all human underneath it all. Matt: Yeah, I absolutely love that you brought this up. At the end of the day, even though LinkedIn is the most buttoned up platform, I think you could say. The people on it are still humans, right? And even the CEO of a company, the founder, is also a normal human being. And so I think, to me, the reason why I think authenticity resonates so strongly on LinkedIn especially is the typical content that you see is, not to say it's not authentic, but it's not really vulnerable. And it's not really showing the other side of what it's like to be a successful founder, which is not always just the revenue numbers going up or the customer numbers going up, but it's the struggles, the mental challenges, the failures, and everything behind the scenes. And one of the most high-performing posts that I've ever made on my account actually was about a number of things that I failed at instead of succeeded at. Daniel: I called it the Museum of Failures, and then it was just a list of things that I didn't succeed at. And I remember being very, very uncomfortable right before I posted it because naturally, I was thinking to myself, do I really want to put this kind of vulnerable information out there for my audience? Matt: Marta, I'm curious for you, like when you're writing for clients or helping them think through authentic personal posts, how do you talk them through that process? Because a lot of people, I think, maybe struggle with opening up online. So how, yeah, what do you say to those people that maybe wanna start but are scared to be a little bit vulnerable? Daniel: I love that. I would say, for me, I always love connecting it to the deeper mission. So before we look into content or strategy, just as I mentioned earlier with branding being a form of self-discovery really, it's about understanding, okay, like, why are you showing up online? How do you want people to feel when they read your post? And connecting to that, because when you connect to that bigger vision for yourself, for your business, but also for how you want to make others feel for the change that you are here to create in the world. It is so much easier than to do the difficult and uncomfortable things because there's a bigger purpose for it. Matt: And understanding how showing up more vulnerably can create that change and create that shift and contribute to that overall, you know, mission and vision and then also understanding that a lot of the time what makes us uncomfortable, it's not always necessarily true. A lot of the time the things we fear the most, like fear is really just a construct. It's a bunch of thoughts in our head that we believe to be true, but they don't have to be. So it's really about understanding like, oh, what about this feels scary? And is this my honest truth or is this something someone else made me believe? Is it coming from ego and wanting to be seen in a certain way, which a lot of the time, of course it is. But then looking at that and understanding the value of showing up vulnerably in support of your mission and others versus hiding away, hiding away your unique voice, which is the very thing that makes you stand out. Daniel: That was so well articulated. And what I'm hearing is it's kind of two things, right? Like the first is the reflecting on why you are posting and understanding what your mission, your goal that is beyond yourself is because you need to have a reason to be posting. You can't just be posting for the sake of posting. Matt: And I love that perspective shift, Daniel. It kind of takes the pressure off, right? When you realize that the stakes aren't as high as we often make them out to be in our minds. It's almost freeing in a way. I mean, just the idea that, you know, there's this big vast internet out there, and a lot of it is just not going to be seen all at once. It's a bit of a relief. Daniel: Content seems to follow more of a power law where, you know, the top 10% of your content is probably getting the majority of the impressions and the engagement. And if you understand that not every single piece of content is going to perform the same way, it's not as, it's not as daunting when one piece doesn't perform as you thought it would. Matt: A hundred percent. Yeah. And I think also removing that like perfectionistic lens from it as well. I mean, it's just life. Like not everything is gonna work out the way you want it to. So, so yeah, I guess putting less pressure on ourselves as well would be a good way to approach it. Daniel: Yeah. And also Marta, you use this very specific term, for those who aren't familiar, with Marta's personal branding business, she often uses the word heart-led founder. Could you just explain a little bit more for our listeners? Everyone who's watching, what that means to you. Matt: That's such a beautiful question. Yes, so for me, it's really about creating from the heart, from the soul of who you are, from your mission, from your vision, rather than from the trends. It's really about, you know, being rooted in who you are, what you came here to do, why you're showing up online and in your business, and creating from that space, like from that unique essence that only you have, sharing that gift, you know, that only you can share with the world because it comes from you. It comes from a mix of your unique essence, your talents, your life experiences. Matt: So it's about connecting to that space, what's true to you, to what's unique to you rather than looking at, you know, trends or what performs well or what the world wants you to be and rather really connecting with who you are and letting that shine through how you show up both in life and online. Daniel: I love that. How did you, how did you even come to this idea of like a heart-led founder? Was it like a process that took you time from your own personal journey or did you wake up one day and think, oh yeah, I wanna help people create heart-led content that's authentic to them? Matt: Wow. I'm not sure actually. I think it might've just come through naturally. I really can't pinpoint a specific moment. I don't think it was a creative strategy brainstorm. It was more about, yeah, you know, like I love creating from the heart. For many, many years, I believed that my passion and my unique talents, the things that I'm actually good at, were just a hobby. I find that so many people grow up believing that, you know, this old belief that luckily is now falling away, that life is meant to be hard, that you're not meant to like your job, you know, you're meant to live for the weekend. Daniel: So for many years, it was hard for me to fully accept that actually the things that I love that come to me naturally that require next to no effort are really the things that, you know, deserve to be put out there, that I deserve to get paid for, that it's not just something I need to put in this, you know, bracket of a hobby. And I think when I realized that and started showing up with that energy, sort of heart-led element naturally came through, I would imagine it was connected to that. Matt: Wow. I really wanna dig into that thread, Marta. What are some of the biggest things that you've had to unlearn in life and in content creation? Daniel: I would say the biggest learning for me was when I first started working as a content creator. And I was doing really great. I mean, it was incredible. I was going on press trips to some of the most incredible destinations in the world, working with truly amazing brands, going to fabulous events. But again, deep down, and I don't think I shared this anywhere, so it's really exciting to be able to talk about it, you know, going back to vulnerability. Deep down, I still kept thinking that it's just a hobby. And because of that subconscious belief, it's not something I would maybe say to myself out loud, but it's something that affected my energy, that affected how I was showing up, how I was investing in my business. Daniel: That always in some way limited me in how I could have grown in that space or the opportunities I maybe could have created for myself, had it not been for that subconscious belief of, oh, I enjoy it, therefore it's a hobby, but the real work is in whatever else. I was still working freelance back then on a lot of marketing and tech projects, and they were all fun, but that's not where my heart was. So I think looking back, that was the biggest learning that if I allowed myself to accept that, no, this is my passion. I love it. Let's put all my time and energy into it and see where it takes me rather than treating it as a still very fun, exciting, and expansive hobby. Perhaps I could have grown through it differently. Matt: So it sounds like what you had to unlearn was this idea that your hobby cannot possibly be your, I'm hesitant to use the word job because I think there's a lot of connotations around that, but your hobby, essentially, you didn't think that that thing you were doing on the side, which you were pretty good at and excited by, could turn into a full-time career. Daniel: Yeah, exactly. But then full-time career that could maybe sustain you in the same way that other ways of working could. You know, once I realized that, oh, wait, like that's, that's the fear that's running the show, then I started to, of course, create things that make it shift. But yeah, this is the thing with subconscious beliefs. Matt: I think a lot of the time, we're not fully aware that they are there or we're just operating from this system that's been instilled in us. And it takes a moment to slow down and reflect and, you know, look at everything that's going on in your life to stop and think, oh, wait, it doesn't have to be this way, actually, you know, if, if I love doing it, if there's genuine passion behind it, and I'm contributing something deeper, then a hundred percent, this is such a beautiful way of making a living. Daniel: Dang, and it doesn't even feel like a job, so I completely see why you didn't even want to mention the word, right? There's a lot of connotations that come with it. Yeah, man, so many thoughts there, but the word job, I think a lot of people automatically will associate with something that they maybe don't enjoy as much or they kind of are forced to do because they have to make a living. And I think that when you take something that turns your hobby into a source of income, for some people, there's also this fear that I'm no longer going to enjoy it once it becomes the thing that pays my rent. Because now it's like, I have to do this instead of I'm doing this because I enjoy it. Matt: Have you found a good way to sort of balance that tension between obviously running your business, which is focused on content creation and also continuing to enjoy content creation as is? Because personally, Marta, one of the things that I struggle with as someone who's been making content for over two years at this point, is that I go through periods of motivation where I'm very much interested in the content that I'm making. I have so many ideas, maybe I was talking to lots of other creators or people in my life that gave me inspiration, and I'm just posting very consistently. But then maybe six months later, I'm going through a rut, a creative rut, and I feel like I'm kind of just posting for the sake of posting because I need to stay consistent. Or because, you know, I need to make money or I have a brand sponsor that I agreed to do and, you know, it feels a little bit forced there. So I'm curious for you, how do you manage that tension? Daniel: Love that question. And also, I just wanted to say, I think what you're feeling is completely normal, regardless of how much you love or dislike your job. Those feelings are so valid and they will always show up because we're only human, right? And when we are the ones that are both the managers of our, you know, our business, the owners, the creatives, the scriptwriters, it gets overwhelming because you're not just creating content, right? There's so many other roles that you have to play in the content creation game. Daniel: And I think we don't admit just how tiring or demotivating it can get at times. So I think this is completely valid. What I like to do is change have to to get to do. So instead of saying, Oh gosh, I have to wake up this morning and I have to record this reel, or I change it to, but I get to do this. Like, I get to wake up this morning on my own schedule, sit down by the desk in the apartment that I love and I get to create something that I really enjoy doing. And maybe today my energy is a bit low and, you know, we all have those days, but at the end of the day, I chose to do this for a reason. So it's about acknowledging how you feel and giving yourself the space to feel all those feelings. Maybe there's some deeper meaning behind them as well. Maybe there are some ways in your processes that, you know, are asking for you to make a change. Maybe you're just tired, right? But then looking at the bigger picture and reminding yourself that you don't actually have to do any of this. You're just choosing to, and that completely changes your energy and your attitude. Matt: Yeah, I absolutely love that, Marta. The reframing of the mindset from, I have to do this, which gives you a sense of like on being forced to do something that I don't wanna do to, I get to do this. Like I'm lucky. I'm fortunate. Daniel: Well, Matt, that's such a common fear. I think a lot of people struggle with that initial self-doubt, especially when they're surrounded by a sea of content that seems polished and authoritative. What I usually tell people is that everyone has a unique perspective or experience that no one else can replicate. It's about finding that voice and sharing it authentically. And you know, sometimes the most relatable content is born out of personal stories and genuine experiences. Matt: Absolutely, Daniel. And it's interesting because, sometimes, the things you think are insignificant might be the very thing that resonates with someone else out there. You just never know who needs to hear your message. Daniel: I would say, going back to what you've just said, there's so many other voices online, but none of them are yours. And that's your superpower because you're unique. Like your perspective, your experiences, how you go through the world, it's unique to whatever else is out there. Right, it's a little bit like there's a lot of bakeries, but we all need bread, right? There's a reason why you would go for that specific little bakery down the corner, because maybe, I don't know, they make that sourdough that you really love, or maybe the smell of the bread reminds you of your childhood, or maybe you'll go to a completely different place. There's a reason why you pick one YouTuber or one content creator over the other, one founder over the other, because they resonate with you on a different level, and I think it's just about remembering that your uniqueness is your superpower, and actually the fact that there's no one else out there with your voice and your message. That's unique. That's the sign to keep going. And also, from a more maybe practical standpoint, there's a lot of people out there, but I would say the market is saturated, not necessarily competitive. So once you combine that unique essence, those gifts that only you have with a strategy that amplifies them, that helps you show up in a unique way, then you will reach the right people. Matt: It may take some time, all good things in life, sometimes slower, not always, but a lot of the time it takes some time, but a lot of the time it's not as long as you think it would be. And if you're enjoying the process, then it makes it so much easier to make it happen anyway. Daniel: Let's switch gears now to talking a little bit more LinkedIn specific. Marta, when you post on your personal account, what is your thought process behind each post? Like, how do you go from idea to actually hitting post? Matt: Yeah, so the first thing for me would be getting clear on why I'm posting, right? And that can change month for month. Like if I'm in launch, maybe I'm launching an offer that I want to talk about, then the way I structure my content, the things I focus on, the things I talk about will change slightly. So first is the intention, like why am I showing up? What's my biggest goal now? And how can my content contribute to that? Then another thing I would do is I often keep a lot of like notes and thoughts that come to me in my notes app on my phone, so I don't use any specific app for it. Or sometimes just pen and paper. I'll jot down my ideas, whatever comes to mind, and then connect it to that goal that I'm working on. Daniel: So before I get into content pillars and, you know, dividing them into inspiration and connection and sales content, which of course we all need to do, I would again let it come from me, let it come from the heart, let it be something that I'm excited, and then once I have a bunch of those different ideas, strategize them a little bit based on, again, what's the main goal, what are my content pillars, the things I really want to be known for that I talk about on LinkedIn, and how am I structuring that towards the connection type content and sales type content, or maybe the authority type where I'm showing up more as, you know, like sharing the knowledge, sharing the expertise. Matt: I love that you have a structured approach. I'm a former management consultant, and one of the things that we love is good structure. And I like the idea of content pillars. Daniel: I've recently been also doing a lot of ghostwriting for a number of different clients, and one of the things that has been most helpful for me is also structuring out the content so we understand, first of all, what's the purpose of this post before we even write it? Is it supposed to be more top of funnel, to build awareness? Is it just trying to demonstrate that you know the space that you're in and you're an authority? Or is it to try to humanize you and show people that, hey, this person, you know, maybe they run a very successful business, but at the end of the day, they've also gone through the same challenges that you have before. And I find that when I explain it to them in that way, like, hey, this is how we're going to craft your content this week, it's very easy for people to understand that because if you just go to someone who's not created much content before and you say, all right, just go and start posting five times a week, a lot of times they're very unsure. Okay, what do I post about? Like what format? What topic? How do I even write it for LinkedIn? There's a lot of questions. And so I love that you bring up the content pillars because I think structuring that approach is so important to creating content that actually is going to drive results to your business. Matt: I also wanted to ask you, Martha, so once you have the content pillars, then how do you go about actually writing the posts themselves? Daniel: So I would always start with a rough draft that I create myself. I know that everyone these days is using AI and ChatGPT, and I actually feel like it's so important to address that. I don't think there's any shame in that, but it's making sure, I would say, at least for me, that AI doesn't completely replace your creativity, but that it amplifies it, right? Because of course, if there is a way you can automate your day-to-day tasks in a way that still sounds and looks like you, that's fantastic. But I think it's so important to still have that connection to what you're creating and staying on top of things in terms of, you know, your mission, vision, and all those other elements we've talked about. What I love... Love using AI for is also analytics. So understanding which of my posts perform well, which don't, what people want to see more of, and then creating content that aligns with that, and that right now is not a feature that's available on LinkedIn, at least not in the way that I would love to see it. So I love using AI to help me understand the performance and what resonates and then what doesn't, and then combining that information within the content creation process so that what I'm creating is actually resonating. Repeating the same thing that just doesn't land is, yeah, it's not the best use of your time. 100%. Daniel: And I'm so glad you addressed that, Marta, because pretty much everyone that we've brought on the podcast and every time I talk to people about posting on LinkedIn, they're like, there's so much AI-generated content, especially on written platforms, because it's so easy for someone to ChatGPT a LinkedIn post. And I think there's people in both camps where one side is like, totally anti-AI and they're like, you should not write with AI at all. And then there's the other side that is pro-AI, and they're like, this is the next big thing. We have to get on board with it. I think there's a spectrum and it's not as black and white as people make it out to be. I think that AI is just a tool, right? So at the end of the day, you're the human. You are the one that is going to come up with the idea and have the judgment to pick the idea that you think will resonate the most with your audience. And then AI can help you to refine and maybe even come up with a first draft of that post, but ultimately I think the best content creators are going to find a way to still make it authentic and genuine and to really humanize that content, even if they started with something that maybe an AI came up with. I'm curious, do you start with writing the post first and then use the AI to kind of like help you revise afterwards, or are you using it first to come up with like the ideas and the initial draft even and then injecting like your own voice into it? Matt: I usually start by drafting the post first. Matt: In fact, I would have a pool of ideas and then what AI would help me with is maybe strategize the content, right? So let's say, okay, these are my ideas and I want it to be 40%, let's say, authority and 40% connection. So instead of then me sitting and manually figuring out what goes where, it would almost act as my content manager that helps me put it all into place. And then from there, I'm always the one who comes up with the first draft, the structure, and then I would use AI almost as my editor and like, oh, is there a way of, you know, saying this in a way that lands a little bit better or makes a better point. But funnily enough, some of my best performing posts, I actually didn't write them with AI. A lot of the time it was just me having an idea and typing it up on LinkedIn app, thinking, Oh gosh, I'm just kind of posting this on a spur of a moment. I don't think it's gonna perform that well, but it did because it's again, it was connected to something that was either important to me or maybe a message that like really came from the heart or more of a vulnerable share. So I think it's always about finding that balance and also not just posting for the sake of engagement because that can easily block you, whether you're using AI or not, but also posting because you have something exciting you wanna share and that energy is priceless and it will show for your posts. I truly believe that, that it will. And that's something AI can't quite replicate, right? Yeah. Daniel: I so much agree with that. I think that a couple of thoughts, right? One, a lot of people overthink this virality thing and they try to over-engineer it. I think especially, and maybe this is more common with people who have not gone viral before because they think that there's this, there's a secret formula where you need to do all these things right, and then your post will definitely go viral, but that's just not the case. And when people talk about the algorithm, I think they should really be thinking about like just people in general, your audience, right? Because the algorithm is just showing people what they wanna see. So at the end of the day, you shouldn't be thinking about like optimizing for some software or some algorithm, some technology. It's really optimizing for what other people in the world in your audience want to see and will, what will resonate deeply with them enough so that they either like share it or engage with it or just like rewatch it, which then gives the social media platforms all the signals that tells them to push it to more people. I'm blanking on the second thing I was gonna bring up with you. But one other thing, Marta, I wanted to ask you about as well is, do you do a lot of comments on LinkedIn? And if so, like, have you noticed anything about commenting and the impact that it might have on driving engagement? Matt: Yeah, I would say commenting is like a huge part of your LinkedIn growth. Matt: But and again, that goes back to, well, it's social media, we've got to be social, right? So it's not just about having a voice heard. It's about being a part of the community. So I would actually say that the one thing that's almost just as important as posting is commenting, is engaging with other people. This is also a really fantastic way of growing your like outbound strategy where you attract more visibility, more potential clients, not just for your posts, but also through comments. Not to mention, again, not everything has to be strategic in terms of I'm only gonna comment on this person post because I'm hoping that, you know, I'll get a comment back. Or it could also just be curiosity or genuinely wanting to connect and expand your network. So I would say it's so important to also focus on that because there's so many incredible people hanging out on LinkedIn. It's like one big networking event. It's really worth connecting with others. But I would say a hundred percent, like if you're a bit overwhelmed with posting, post twice a week, but then comment daily and be strategic about who you're connecting with and you will start seeing a shift. Also if you were just posting but never interacting with anyone. Daniel: That is so true. I think a lot of people think when they want to start posting or building an audience in general on LinkedIn, that then they just need to start posting. And that's true, but it's not the full picture. Daniel: The commenting and the relationship building on LinkedIn, I think, is something that is so powerful, but I think a lot of people aren't actually maximizing this. And treating it more like a blog almost where you just like push out your content to the world without as much social interaction. And I'm curious for you, Marta, you and I, obviously we met on LinkedIn. You talked about DMs earlier. What kind of DMs do you usually get from people and do you send a lot of DMs as well to people that you recently connected with or engaged with? Matt: Oh, yeah, a hundred percent. So whenever I would send a connection request, I always make sure I send a DM. And likewise, if someone connects with me, I make sure I message them back. And if I don't hear back from them, I actually often go ahead and delete the connection. Because for me, it's so important to connect with people who genuinely want to establish some kind of a rapport with you rather than just sort of, you know, mass follow and then never engage again. And that's actually something I recommend to my clients as well. Obviously, you want to give everyone some time to reply, but at the same time, you want to connect with people who are active and who want to establish some kind of a conversation or relationship with you. So in terms of the DMs, a lot of the time it's wellness founders who are either interested in my work or they just resonate with my message. Maybe I did a post or left a comment somewhere and it really spoke to them. Daniel: It's aligned with their mission or aligned with who they are as people and they just want to have someone like-minded in their network, which is always lovely. So it's either this or people that are, you know, looking at growing their personal brand on LinkedIn, growing their profile and are looking at either working with me or just exploring different opportunities. Matt: It's so interesting that you will DM everyone and then if they, if they don't respond, say like after, obviously you give them some time. Yeah. Remove that connection. Do you think that's contributed to the high engagement that you get on your content because everyone in your network is so well, one, they're active and two, they're probably like excited to engage with you. Daniel: Thank you. Well, I think it might have. I don't think it's the people that are only my close connections that comment. It's also like you have the option to follow. So I do get some of my comments and likes from the followers, but I definitely think that that still makes a difference, right? Because then you're making sure that the people that you are genuinely connected with, they are interested in following you and vice versa. And of course that does make a difference in your engagement. Matt: Yeah, I think so. It's not something I've ever measured, but I'm sure it plays, it plays a role. I think it definitely contributes. I've never measured it per se, but I definitely think so. Daniel: I think when you're really strategic and you really curate who you connect with, it always makes a difference, right? That said, there's also the option for people to follow you rather than connect and then they will still like and comment. So it's kind of hard to tell, but I'm sure that it plays a role. Yeah. What are some of the best messages that you've received on LinkedIn? Because I know, you know, founders, executives, they're probably getting flooded in their LinkedIn DMs by people that want to sell them stuff or, you know, people that want to talk to them. I'm sure you also get a lot of DMs as well. What makes a message stand out to you? Matt: Oh, I love this question. And I think for me, it's the messages where someone says that, you know, my post really resonated with them and it made them feel better about, you know, what's happening in their life or it made them feel seen. It made some kind of a difference on how they feel. And for me, that's where the real value is, you know? And of course, it's lovely to get messages from potential clients or people want to work with you. I mean, that's incredible, right? But to know that I've contributed to someone's life on a more emotional level, that's just so beautiful. And yeah, I always love receiving those kind of messages as well. Daniel: Have you gotten a lot of voice notes before? Matt: Oh, actually quite a few, yeah. It's kind of nice. I mean, like, it's a nice way to connect. Matt: Messages are great, but I think once you message someone a couple of times and then they go ahead and send a voice note, it's really lovely. And I've done it a couple of times as well. And every time I did, I would always get like a very positive reply back, right? Someone saying, oh, like it's, I think we feel each other's energy and like personality so much more through voice notes rather than just messages. So it's a nice way to build the connection. I wouldn't send the voice note as the first message to someone, but if we've messaged for a while, I think it's nice. It helps build that connection. Daniel: Yeah, that's something that I personally have been using a bit with my messages. And I find that, one, they get a pretty high response rate if you do it right, because people are curious when they see the little blue voice note bubble pop up. So they're most likely going to listen to it. And two, you can just give so much more information about you in a 20-second voice note versus a paragraph-long DM. And I love that, Marta, you brought up the energy point because, yeah, when you hear someone's voice, there's more information being conveyed beyond just like the actual words that they're saying, right? Whereas a DM, just a text DM, is great, but you can only get across so much about you as a person. Matt: And I don't think that the DM strategy of sending voice notes to everyone necessarily makes sense for every single person out there, but if you are someone who, you know, really wants to convey who you are to a certain audience or you know that you're the person that you're DMing gets a lot of messages, then it's worth considering because you can potentially stand out that way. Daniel: 100%, yeah. And I think it's also, like you said, it's the emotional connection, but also the intention behind it. You can kind of, you know, based on the tone of voice and just, you know, being able to interact with someone on a more personal level, it's just easier to sort of suss out that side of things as well. So it's just, it's a more personal way of connecting. Marta, question for you. If you were the CEO of LinkedIn, is there anything that you'd want to change about the platform? I know you mentioned earlier analytics, but I just want to dive into this a little bit more. Is there anything that you wish they would add to LinkedIn? Matt: I think analytics might actually be something that could be improved in some way. In a way what I love about LinkedIn is that it's so simple. They don't add all those different features that, let's say, Instagram uses, like the, you know, the stories, then the threads. I personally, I'm so happy that LinkedIn steers clear from that because it just makes the whole process so much simpler and easier and less complicated. Daniel: You don't feel like you have to try 10 different things to get traction. So I would say the analytics part, I think having a space where it clearly shows, okay, right, so you know, this post performed well versus, you know, the other posts in your feed and maybe having a little bit of clarity on why and some kind of simple way of understanding what works, what doesn't. I think that would be quite great, actually. Hopefully they're gonna add that in the future, especially now that LinkedIn is a full-blown content creator platform, right? That would be really great to see, but other than that, I'm really happy that they keep it simple, and in fact, I'm really hoping they will not be adding any kind of Stories feature or anything along those lines. It feels like a breath of fresh air that it's one less thing to think about when you land on LinkedIn. Matt: Yeah, that's a really interesting perspective that you appreciate how simple the platform is, maybe compared to other platforms. I agree with you. I think better analytics would probably benefit everyone on the platform. One thing that we've also heard is people wish they had a little bit more creator monetization built into the platform because right now, obviously, if you're posting on LinkedIn, it's not like Instagram or YouTube where, you know, maybe you can get like ad revenue or they have a monetization program. Daniel: I'm not sure if one actually exists for LinkedIn, so there's less incentive for people to be creators on LinkedIn unless, of course, they're like you and I and our businesses depend on it. But yeah, curious if there's, is there anything else besides the analytics that you wish they would change or I know right now they're trying to push video. Any thoughts on that? Matt: Well, again, in my know of LinkedIn being so simple and me loving that side of it, I would, I mean, I think video is great. Again, it helps convey your personality, your energy. It's fantastic. Personally, I would rather use it as an add-on to my existing content rather than go into making videos full time for every post. But I think it's a nice, nice feature to have. That's for sure. But going back to what you were saying about monetization, that's actually such a great point because right now, if you're monetizing LinkedIn as a content creator, other than, you know, finding clients through it, it would be through brand collaborations, but then LinkedIn does not have a feature that helps you monetize that. So actually that would be a great way of looking at it or maybe some kind of an affiliate program because I feel like I've been talking about LinkedIn so much, even on Instagram or recommending it to my friends that they get themselves on LinkedIn. It would be great to, you know, start making money off of all those recommendations. Daniel: How do you pitch LinkedIn to your friends when, you know, maybe they are interested? Matt: Yeah, so a lot of my friends, you know, they've been on Instagram for many years and they just don't get any traction, not to mention it's a lot, I don't want to say a lot harder, I would say maybe just a little bit more time-consuming to create content for Instagram than it is for LinkedIn, especially if your static posts are well-performing. So there's a lot of that frustration there. Of course, there's a lot of ways you can streamline the process and make it a lot easier. It's not hard per se, but whenever, you know, I have those conversations with friends and they find that, you know, the algorithm is just not in favor of what they are posting, a lot of the time that really means they are not being rendered enough, but that's another story. I recommend that they get over on LinkedIn because it's just so much easier to gain traction at a much lesser time investment. So like the, when you look at the ratio of how long it takes you to write a well-performing post on LinkedIn versus how long it would take to create a nice, you know, beautiful, aesthetic piece of content for Instagram, obviously, you know, I'll be always leaning more towards LinkedIn. And also the conversations that I've been having on LinkedIn, I would say that I've been able to connect with so many incredible founders on there. Daniel: I'm not saying that they aren't hanging out on Instagram because of course they are, but I definitely noticed the difference in the quality of conversations and how I was able to build my connections on LinkedIn versus Instagram. At least in the last couple of years, that was a very different story years ago, I think. Matt: That's really fascinating. Would you say there's a big difference between the DMs that you get on Instagram versus LinkedIn? Daniel: Oh yeah, I would say so. Yeah. That might be just my personal experience though. So I'm by no means talking for everyone, but I definitely see a huge difference in that. Matt: And it sounds like the DMs and conversations that you're having on LinkedIn are just another level of maybe intellectual or interesting or just the people that you're connecting with and having conversations with are different, right? On LinkedIn versus on Instagram. Daniel: It's usually like a business owner or someone who's like a professional versus on Instagram, you know, those people are probably also on Instagram, but the audience is a lot more diverse and there's people from different walks of life. So I can imagine that the messages are different. The conversations are different. Matt: A hundred percent. But it's also my content that's different, right? So the content I post on Instagram, it's a little bit more lifestyle. I'll still share some of the similar messages, but it's definitely more like self-focused than the things I would share on LinkedIn. Daniel: So I would imagine that also plays a role. But yeah, it's, yeah, when it comes to the depth of the conversations or the type of people that want to connect with you and they really do want to connect, you know, they want to have some kind of a conversation, maybe, you know, collaborate or just grab a virtual coffee, get to know each other more. Like that usually comes from LinkedIn. Matt: Amazing. So Marta, what advice would you give to someone who today wants to start posting on LinkedIn? And maybe they're a founder and they want to start building their audience online. What would you say to them? Daniel: I would say just start because it's that moment just before we're about to start something new or take a leap into the unknown, whether it's posting or a new project, that's when we start overthinking. And once that, you know, starts, it's really hard to make a move. So I would say once you have this idea, write the post, start showing up and do it without focusing too much on the strategy or what it is exactly that you're going to start posting because the role becomes a lot clearer once you start walking it. It's great if you can get some support along the way, of course, if you want to invest in your content creation journey, but if you are not at that stage yet, just start. I think that's the most important part and be curious about it. I find that we often get so serious about everything that we do. Daniel: It's like, oh gosh, you know, if I'm gonna do this, then, you know, you focus on the likes and the content and the end result, and we forget to enjoy the journey. We forget why we're showing up in the first place, just having a bit of fun with it and just going for it and then kind of optimizing and, you know, tweaking your strategy as you go rather than starting off with a full blown strategy or rather waiting to start with a full blown strategy because not many people start that way. I would say that's the advice I wish someone gave me when I first started. Matt: I absolutely love that and resonate with everything that you just mentioned. To close things out, Marta, we have an interesting segment called good idea, bad idea. And normally my co-host Daniel will run this, but today I'm gonna be doing it and we're gonna have fun with it. So I have a few different ideas. Some of them, I think, are more general to LinkedIn. Others are potentially more related to your business, but I'm gonna just rapid fire go through them and I want you to tell me completely brutally honest if it's a good idea or a terrible idea that we shouldn't try to do. Okay, let's press on. All right, so first is just posting five times a day on LinkedIn. Daniel: I would say no, drop it. Bad idea. Matt: Okay. Second one is a little bit more specific. I know you talk about having soul-led content. Matt: What if there was something called a soul meter on LinkedIn, which sort of tells you how soul-filled or soulless your post is? Daniel: I love that. Is that a good or a bad idea? I would love to see that. I'm all for it. Yes, that's a yes from me. Matt: OK, we got Marta's buy-in. Next one is reposting your own posts. Daniel: Actually, yes, that's something I tried out for a couple of weeks and it worked quite well for me. Just make sure you delete the reposts later if you want to keep it. And keep monitoring the progress. I wouldn't say it's something you want to use as a part of your ongoing strategy. Matt: Do you wait a certain amount of time before reposting your own posts? Daniel: I would maybe do it the next day around the same time that I do the post. So I would wait like around 24 hours, but it's been working out quite well. Matt: Very interesting. I'll have to try it out. The next idea is graduating from college. Daniel: As in talking about your college experience or just to make sure I understand. Matt: Yeah, like, is it a good idea or a bad idea for people who want to, say, become full-time content creators or to run a business off of LinkedIn to go to college or graduate from it? Or should they just go all in? Daniel: Oh, yeah, no, I think it's great. I mean, if that's something that, you know, you want to enjoy the trajectory, you want to take, then 100%. Matt: I mean, I'm a huge geek, so I was super excited to go to university and I love learning and studying, but it's not everyone's journey, right? So it's about choosing what works for you, right? I'll take it. Next thing is LinkedIn groups. Good idea or bad idea? Daniel: I think it could be a good idea for as long as it doesn't turn into one of those spammy engagement posts. So it's all about striking the right balance, right? Matt: 100%. I think there's a lot of work that LinkedIn can do with its group slash community features. Cause let's be honest, I don't think many people are actually active in a lot of those groups and they kind of turn into like people just pitching inside of the group and not much else. Daniel: Exactly. So I think quality over quantity as always, right? Matt: 100%. Bold text in LinkedIn posts. Good or bad? Daniel: Yeah. Well, I use it quite a bit, so I would say it's good. I only really use it for maybe like two or three sentences when I really want to highlight a specific message, but I wouldn't, you know, overuse it. Matt: Yeah. Also question on that. You have a very interesting kind of bold text in your posts. How do you actually get that? Because you can't do it in LinkedIn's native posts. Daniel: Yeah. Yeah. It doesn't let you do it. So I use a website called, I think it's called Yatext.com. I'm sure there's many others. This was just the very first one that came up on Google when I looked for it and I've been using it ever since. So yeah, it seems to be working. Daniel: But yeah, it's a bit weird that LinkedIn doesn't give you that feature. I think it would be quite helpful. Yeah. I think we need to add that to like the list of things that LinkedIn CEO needs to add is like, it feels kind of basic, right? Like let us hold our tech. This is a whole other conversation though, so I won't sidetrack us on that. Matt: Last one is a LinkedIn fast, where you take a two-day cold turkey break from LinkedIn. Yeah, I've done it many times. I would say your mental health always comes first. So a hundred percent, like, go ahead and do it. And chances are your engagement is actually not going to suffer if you then continue on showing up consistently. So yeah, a hundred percent. I mean, it's just a tool at the end of the day, right? You have to tend to the real life at times and life gets in the way. So. Mental health is important, everybody. Daniel: Cool. Well, the last question then, Marta, is just if there's anything else we haven't talked about that you want to share with the audience, feel free to let them know. Otherwise, where can they find you on the social media platforms? Matt: Thank you so much. We've covered so many things. I don't think there's anything else I would love to add. But then it was so lovely being here and having this conversation with you. It was so much fun. And you can find me on LinkedIn, of course, under Marta Ross. And if you're listening, feel free to send me a DM or connect. I would love to hear from you. Daniel: And more than anything, thank you so much, Max. It was it was great chatting. Matt: Amazing. Thanks, Marta. Thank you. So much.