The best networking advice you’ve never heard

Transcription

Matt: So Daniel, hear me out on this. I've had a bunch of people ask me recently how the heck you and I managed to land some of the guests for our podcast and what our strategy is around that. Because to date, even though our podcast is only a few months old, we have had multiple LinkedIn top voices on the pod. We have had CEOs of hundred-million-dollar companies, and we've also even had Spencer Jones from the Denver Nuggets, an NBA player, on the podcast. And we've got world-famous professors like Aswath Damodaran also on the pod. So I think it'd be interesting for the audience to actually hear a little bit more about how we leverage LinkedIn effectively to land some of the guests that we do on our podcast, even though it's such a new show. What do you think? Daniel: This is a great idea. And a few things that come to mind immediately that the audience should know that's key to getting the guests is that we ask. Most people are afraid to post content. Most people are afraid to ask someone to come on the show. And asking is the first step. Now, it's not as easy as asking ChatGPT to write an email for you. Like, no one's going to say yes to that because you don't really care. But asking is something that I think is very important to talk about because most people are too scared to even do that. And the same reason most won't even post content on LinkedIn. Matt: That is so right. And it's such a simple thing. I think a lot of people are probably listening to this and rolling their eyes like, oh, okay, yeah. Like, of course, I should ask. Like, no, no, duh, Matt and Daniel. You're telling me what I already know. But it's one of those things where sometimes you do need to be reminded of how important it is to make the ask because I think, especially when you're on LinkedIn and you're looking at someone's profile and maybe they've got a top voice badge or you see they've got like 20,000 followers, it can be a little bit intimidating. You almost view them on a little bit of a pedestal. So you may not even want to shoot them a note because of the fear that you're going to get ghosted or you're going to get rejected. And let me tell you, that happens to me and Daniel all the time. Daniel, how many DMs do you think you've sent at this point for the pod? Daniel: Matt, honestly, I don't even know if I can count that high. Seriously. Matt: Exactly. Same with me. It's got to be in the hundreds, if not thousands of messages sent to people that we have wanted to be guests on the pod who said no. Most of them either are too busy and don't respond or they are too busy and they do respond and they just say not now or they're not interested. They don't want to be on some small unknown podcast about LinkedIn. And just you wait, though. They tell us straight up, look, guys, sorry. It doesn't seem like it's worth my time. I'm a busy guy. I'm running a business and I have to be very selective about where I invest my limited time. Everyone's only got 24 hours in a day. Matt: And I totally understand that as someone who's running a business myself and as a content creator, I get it. No, nobody owes us any kind of conviction or belief in our podcast in the very beginning. And for the people that do support our channel and our podcast, especially the ones who have supported since day one, you guys know who you are. Thank you. And we'll never forget you. But I think it's important to remember that nobody owes you any kind of support or attention. And so you've got to play the numbers game, even when you're sending 100, 200, 500 messages. Expect that only a small percentage of people are actually going to respond. But now that we've established it's a numbers game, you've got to be persistent. You can't give up, like all things in life, Daniel. I think the audience would find it pretty helpful to actually understand tactically how we reach out to folks, whether it is, and maybe there's like two different buckets. One is like people that we've been nurturing on LinkedIn. And you maybe have some sort of preexisting relationship or you've messaged them before. How do you pitch them on the pod? And then for people that are completely, don't even know who we are, sometimes we send them a cold email. And I'm happy to dive into that is too, like sending videos and stuff like that. That's almost a separate strategy. It's honestly hard to keep track of all the outreach we do because it's so much and it's just a habit. But I think there are some tangible things that we should give the audience that have worked well for us. And there's one specific line that we've used a lot that I want to get into after we talk about these specific strategies. And remind me to come back to that, Max. I think that line is pretty important. Daniel: But starting with LinkedIn specific outreach, I think it's really important that you have a clean profile page. Because when someone sends an email, the beauty of LinkedIn over email is that the person who receives the message is going to click on your profile and say, is this someone I want to talk to? If they haven't updated their LinkedIn profile in five years and they're still in high school, you're probably not going to respond. But if they look legit, they have some good takes, they're more likely to respond. So first, you should have an updated profile. Second, something that helps when getting more people to respond is posting content. Because like we've said on many episodes before, you never know who's watching. This person could have seen your comment or your content. Some person that that person that you want to contact is connected with may have left a comment on one of your posts. So they've seen your profile before. So it's really helpful to make content. The last tip, which is huge, and we talked about this a lot with the Noah Greenberg episode, is to leave comments on their content. Matt: If you want to have someone on the podcast or you want to talk to someone, the odds are they're likely making content. Whether it's a sub stack, whether it's LinkedIn, whether it's a newsletter, reply and engage with that and show you're interested because most people who we'll talk to, like if you're going to have Colin and Samir on the show, I am the top 0.1% of listeners of Colin and Samir. It is clear that I know Colin and Samir stuff. They would not want to talk to someone who doesn't know their stuff. Now, of course, they will, but your odds of getting that exception of your response is more likely when you've tailored it and made it clear that you understand who they are and you're not just trying to interview them just for clout chasing, really. Like you want to have a conversation where you can learn stuff and give takeaways for the audience. Daniel: Yeah, that was really well said, Daniel. And something I'll just add to that is the reason why you should be leaving comments on their content before you ever even reach out to them, before you ever make any kind of ask, is because in an ideal scenario, you do not want the first message or first time that they see your name, the first time that they become aware of your existence, you never want that to be in the context of, oh, this guy is trying to extract something from me. He's trying to extract some value. He wants me to come on his podcast so that, you know, he can leverage my existing clout. You never want them to think that, even if that is the case. Like, even if, yes, we obviously are running a podcast and it helps when we have guests that more people know. It helps when the guests are famous or well-known in their specific niches. That is not how you want to come across and that's not the messaging you want. And so you always want some sort of touch point before you actually make the pitch. And for best results on LinkedIn, let's say you got a great profile, it's clean, it's up-to-date, it conveys value, and it conveys some form of expertise and credibility. Then you go and you comment. You like and you comment on their post. You make sure to tag them so that they see the comment in their notification feed. If you only like it, they're unlikely to see that you liked it, especially if it's a post with like 300, 1,000 likes. But if you comment and you tag their name, then you're going to pop up in their notification feed. And sure, maybe only for a second, they're going to be like, okay, I don't know who Daniel Greenberg is. This guy commented on my post. Okay, he commented something kind of interesting. But let's say you do that on another post and then on another post. And over time, even people who have a hundred thousand followers on LinkedIn, they're going to start to notice. They're going to be like, oh, this Daniel Greenberg guy keeps commenting. He's commenting pretty interesting stuff. I can tell he's really excited by the content and what I'm doing. Matt: And then one day, you either shoot him a connection request and they accept, or maybe you're already connected and you shoot him a DM. And by the time you shoot them that DM, they already know that you're not some rando. They've seen you before and they know you're interested and you're not just trying to come in there and the first time that you reach out to them, the first touch point is pitching them to join. I think that's why the commenting strategy is so effective, Daniel, but curious to hear your thoughts there as well on why you think it's so effective. Daniel: One other reason I think commenting is so effective is because at the end of the day, all humans want to be validated. We want to... But you can literally form your own personal engagement pod. Every post that you make, your co-founder also comes, comments, engages. His entire network sees it. Same thing when he posts. And when it comes to the podcast outreach strategy that's absolutely been crushing it for Daniel and I, the double comment strategy of Daniel comments on the CEO of X company's post, tags me in it, and then I jump in, and then I also comment and also tag that person so that they see basically two comments that they're tagged in and two guys that are super jazzed up about whatever they're building. That strategy is... I don't know why more people aren't doing it, honestly. Matt: But Daniel, I think we should talk now a little bit more about the actual messaging strategy now, whether it be through the DMs or some of the cold emails that we sent, like, what lines typically work best when it comes to making the pitch? I was waiting to pivot to this. And one line that we've been using a lot that's been working really well, and that works because we've held true to it, is that we'll do whatever it takes to record this episode. And I think a prime example of this is yesterday, we woke up at 4:45 to run before we interview Jeremy at 7:00 and then had a full workday. He's in France, so the best time to do it was at 7 a.m. with his schedule Eastern time. So we did whatever it took. If it meant running, waking up at 5:00 to do that, we did it. If it means going there and back to LA to interview Eric Wei, we did it. And we've held true to this. And I think that's one line that a lot of our guests respect and can see that we hold true to it and really will do whatever it takes to make the episode happen. So I think that one line has been something that's been unlocked for us getting a lot of awesome guests recently. Daniel: Absolutely. It's such a simple, short phrase, right? We'll do whatever it takes. Five words, but conveys a level of commitment that a lot of our guests respect because a lot of our guests are also people who have built very successful businesses. They understand that success doesn't come easy, especially in the beginning. Matt: And so, yes, it's important to talk about why they should care about what we're building, right? Like we talk about how, you know, we're building a podcast talking about why LinkedIn is the next TikTok and interviewing the top voices. We talk about how both you and I, Daniel, have built our own followings on LinkedIn to over 10,000 followers each. And I have an audience on YouTube of over 180,000. That's all good. And it demonstrates credibility, but think about how often these guys are getting pitched. Every single day, someone like Spencer Jones, forward for the Denver Nuggets. This guy is probably getting 50 DMs a day, maybe more, from brands that want to work with him, founders that want him to promote their product, fans who just want to hop on a call with him and basically anyone else who wants to sell him something is hopping in his DMs. Daniel: What do you think is gonna make Spencer Jones, the forward on the Denver Nuggets, this guy who's got a million thing going on, what do you think is gonna make him want to come on a podcast like Connection Accepted with 400 listeners? Is it the fact that Daniel's got 13,000, 14,000 followers on LinkedIn or the fact that he went to Brown? Is it the fact that I have a large YouTube channel or that I've also built my following on LinkedIn? And the answer is yes, but also no, because he's not as impressed by clout and these people are not as impressed by clout. Matt: What they are impressed by though is when you show them just how committed you are. And so this goes back, this is a very long-winded way of me going back to that original point you made, Daniel. That one line, we'll do whatever the hell it takes to record this episode. Doesn't matter if it means waking up at four in the morning, flying 3,000 miles across the country to do it in person with someone like Eric Wei. It doesn't matter if we're taking a nine o'clock in the evening podcast because Daniel and I both work. Well, I'm running my own business, but Daniel's got a full-time job. And so we're basically working around the clock to make it work. It doesn't matter. We'll do whatever it takes. And that, I think, speaks to these guests in a way that no amount of self-promotion will. Daniel: Another key to good messaging in cold DMs, and this isn't just DMs, this is email too, and it's that you have to treat it like a LinkedIn post. You have to hook in the reader. Because if you just say, hey Spencer, saw that you worked in the NBA, sounds like an ad. You need to write in plain English that they'll want to read and you need to keep them hooked reading. Matt: Think about Spencer going through his 50 DMs. Most of the time when you're going through your email, you'd look at the hook. And if the hook is bad in your email, you delete it. Same with the TikTok. You'll watch the first half to full second of the video and if that isn't good, you just scroll past it. The same is happening in the LinkedIn inbox. You need to write something in plain English that captures emotion. Daniel: And then once they click on that, it needs to be short and gives them a clear response. The clear response at the end of every DM we send is either yes or no. It's either yes, I'm coming on the show or no. If you write them a DM and it's not clear how they should respond, they won't know what to say. They're just going to get through the other 49 DMs. So the point I'm trying to make here is that you should write in plain English, use a hook, draw emotion, and make a clear next step for them after this message. Writing a DM is literally just like writing a LinkedIn post, which is just like writing an email. You shouldn't waste the reader's time at all when doing it. And I think that's something you're really good at, Matt. One thing we've also tried in addition to just writing messages is sending videos. Matt: This is an underrated outreach strategy that I don't see that many people doing, which is when you actually record a personalized video specifically to the person that you want to reach out to. Now I know a lot of you are hearing me say this and thinking that sounds like so much work. And it is, but that's exactly the point. You want to do something that requires so much effort that no one else is going to do it or very few people are going to do it. That's actually going to increase your success rate because your message is going to stand out. So for example, if we're reaching out to the CEO of a $100 million company, one of the things that I might do is I might hop down, sit in front of this camera right here and record a quick 30 to 60-second video where I directly address that person. I say, for example, hey Daniel, you're absolutely crushing it on LinkedIn. And then I introduce myself, talk a little bit about what Connection Accepted is, and then specifically mention a topic or a question that I'd love to dive into with them on the pod. And similar to a LinkedIn post, we have a quick call to action, like, you know, let me know if you're down to come on or not. And then you just end it there. Even though it's only 30 to 60 seconds, there's something so powerful about video and conveying to them that this wasn't just some generic templated message that was sent to a hundred other people. No, this video, I literally sat down, took 60 seconds out of my busy day to record it just for you. That's what you want them to realize. And then when they see that, you know, we'll do whatever it takes to make this happen, they're thinking, oh my gosh, well, these guys, they're clearly onto something and either I want to support them with what they're building because I was in their shoes at one point or this seems like a great idea and I'd love to come on and talk about LinkedIn. So the video strategy is simply a way to convey a high amount of effort. It's also very effective. Because taking a step back here, I think that effective DMs typically have a few different things going on. Effective outreach. Matt: One is the level of personalization. Two is the level of perceived effort. The personalization is important, as we know, because it does take a little bit of time and understanding of who they are to send a message that actually speaks to them specifically. And that's tied to the second one, which is the effort, because yes, you probably spent more effort if it was personalized, but if you can do anything else to show them that you really want them to come on as a guest because you value their experience and you value what they have to say so much that you're willing to take that extra second, go out of your way, do something that's slightly inconvenient just so that you can pitch them on this idea, even though you know they may not say yes, then there's something very powerful about that as well. So Daniel, I think if there's anything that the audience should know about our podcast outreach strategy, it's that one, it's a numbers game. So volume-wise, you and I have collectively sent thousands of messages to potential guests over the last few months. So whoever they see on our pod is a fraction of the number of people that we reached out to. So the consistency is a given. You've got to be doing it. But then when it comes found that is a crazy networking hack is talking about their whoop. So if you're in the audience and you're trying to think, okay, what am I going to say right now? But you see the person has a whoop, that's a great way to easily connect with them. And you want to try to find stuff like that when you're on the phone. The second thing that we didn't hit on that is that we actually provide a good guest experience as well, that that guest then wants to introduce us to other guests, which has happened. To give the audience an example, we had a previous guest on that was a little nervous about coming on the show. They thought that we really just wanted to have them on the show just because of one experience or client that they had. That was not the case and we had a great interview with them, great show. And they also left minute by minute feedback for us of the episode. We sent it to them before, they edited it, and then we put out an edited version. And that's the stuff that we're happy to do because we're not trying to make anyone look bad or anything. That's not the point of Connection Accepted. We're trying to have cool conversations and learn from them and share the takeaways with you all, the audience. So providing a good user experience for the guests and also trying to find something in common will also increase your chances of response and having people tell more people about you. That's a really great point. Matt: And these kinds of things only compound over time because, yes, in the short term, you may be wondering, why does it matter that I have a good guest experience? Why does it matter that I take the extra hour or two to make these tiny revisions that so and so guest wanted us to make before it went live? In the moment, it may not seem like it matters or that it moves the needle, but in the long run, it actually increases your success rate because your previous guests have such a good experience, they wanna go talk about it. It's like when you have a product so good that your customers can't stop talking about it. That's the best form of marketing when they go out unprompted and they start talking about it. That's every founder's dream. And so in the same way with podcasting, where we're a media business and our product is the interviews that we do with our guests, making sure that we have a good product involves making sure that our guests have a great experience. And I'm excited, Daniel, honestly, to see how things progress this year in 2026. We've already had so many great guests on the show and I think there's only big things coming for us this year. To the audience that made it this far, thank you and we'll see you in the next one. Thanks for watching.